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Forum: Site Goals and Ideas
Thread (Discussion): A clarification of a rule please - Steve
Message 166369
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 03, 2005 10:13 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Posting to The Other Side forum is limited to sex offenders, pedophiles and their friends, relatives and supporters. If the creator of a thread in The Other Side forum is open to others responding, the creator may invite specific users, types of users or all others to respond. Such users should consider themselves guests and are expected to act accordingly.
Sex offenders and pedophiles are not permitted to post messages to the Victims and Survivors Corner forum. In addition, anyone whose participation is likely to be found offensive, triggering or inappropriate by victims/survivors and their friends, relatives and advocates, as determined by an administrator, will not be permitted to post messages in that forum.
Steve I just want to make sure I am VERY clear on this one. If I , as the originator of a thread in "the other side" wish to be receiving responses from every one on this forum, I mearly state that either as the opening line of my post or as the subtitle of the post correct?
How does this rule apply if I am not the thread creator but would still like to have responses from all site visitors?
And conversly, in the Victim's and Survivors forum, I am completely unable to post either as a thread creator for a specific victim issue I may be having or in response to a victim that creates a thread even if that victim specifically requests responses from everyone including RSO's?
Sorry if it seems like I am questioning your rules, but I honestly have no desire to seem that way I just want to ensure that I know the rules prior to violating any of them. I believe I heard it quite a few times (even on this site) that "ignorance of the law is no excuse for breaking the law".
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Message 166398 (In Reply to Message 166369)
Posted by orolan
on Nov 04, 2005 02:25 AM | Also by orolan
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: N/A,
Country: United States |
I for one hadn't picked up on that paradox. I didn't realize that offenders were barred EVEN if the victim asked for offender participation.
As an offender let me say what I think about your Other Side questions.
If I , as the originator of a thread in "the other side" wish to be receiving responses from every one on this forum, I mearly state that either as the opening line of my post or as the subtitle of the post correct?
That's how I read it. But I would have to ask you why a topic that you would expect everyone to respond to would be in The Other Side and not the General Forum?
How does this rule apply if I am not the thread creator but would still like to have responses from all site visitors?
Actually in this case you are the one responding to the offender's question. So it isn't right for you to solicit further responses to his question from people he didn't ask.
Often threads run off on tangents. The original subject gets lost and the little side-threads tend to turn in to personal attacks. That's been the biggest problem in all forums.
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Message 166406 (In Reply to Message 166369)
Posted by steve
on Nov 04, 2005 03:01 AM | Also by steve
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Virginia,
Country: United States |
Steve I just want to make sure I am VERY clear on this one. If I , as the originator of a thread in "the other side" wish to be receiving responses from every one on this forum, I mearly state that either as the opening line of my post or as the subtitle of the post correct?
Correct. I recommend adding a note in the post title that it's open to guests, then in the first line of the post stating it's open to guests and including any necessary details about what guests if necessary.
How does this rule apply if I am not the thread creator but would still like to have responses from all site visitors?
In that case, you should either contact the thread creator and ask whether he/she would be willing to open it to guests and if so, one of the two of you posting a reply to the first post in the thread as described above. I'd also be open to moving the thread to the general forum on request from the thread creator.
And conversly, in the Victim's and Survivors forum, I am completely unable to post either as a thread creator for a specific victim issue I may be having or in response to a victim that creates a thread even if that victim specifically requests responses from everyone including RSO's?
Correct. If a thread creator in that forum wants responses from those not permitted in that forum, the thread creator can either post the thread in the general forum or later ask whether it can be moved there. I realize that I am handling the two forums differently. That's because I feel there is more potential for a reader and prospective poster to the Victims and Survivors Corner forum to be made uncomfortable or worse simply by reading a post there by certain types of individuals, regardless of the actual content of the message being read, than is the case if the same should occur in The Other Side.
I'd like to close by noting that in my recent site policies post, the words "Until further notice" should not be overlooked. I am instituting some changes and I will be evaluating their effect. This isn't directed at you, but I wanted to say that no one should assume this is a final solution and alternate and additional changes in policies, procedures and mechanism won't be considered and implemented.
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Message 166437 (In Reply to Message 166406)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 04, 2005 02:29 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Steve, first let me start out by saying thank you for the clarification. I read the rules and just wanted to make sure I didn't violate them. Since I value the opinion of some on this forum that would be barred from posting in the Other Side I was very curious as to whether I, as a respondant to another's thread, was allowed to invite one of those barred people's opinion and this clarification answered that quite well.
The only thing still not 100% clear to me is whether or not I, as a RSO, am allowed to create a thread in the Victims corner if that thread is SOLELY about dealing with a specific Victim/Survivor issue I might be having?
I did note the "until further notice" line in the post you made, and I realize that this is something that is likely to change as the need arises. I didn't mention it because I felt it was self explanitory.
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Message 166439 (In Reply to Message 166398)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 04, 2005 02:37 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
I for one hadn't picked up on that paradox. I didn't realize that offenders were barred EVEN if the victim asked for offender participation.
Knowing your attention to detail I take that as a compliment. :-)
But I would have to ask you why a topic that you would expect everyone to respond to would be in The Other Side and not the General Forum?
I could visualize a issue being discussed that possibly the offender or a respondant to an offender might wish to solicit the advise of someone in LE such as dp1, DTCDTT, or Eagle. The issue might be very specifically related to Sex Offender issues and could POSSIBLY not be something that the offender doesn't want to be having "bashing" responses to, so he/she posts into the Forum designated as being for SO's only, but later decides that the advise of one of our LE members might be highly useful.
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Message 166440 (In Reply to Message 166406)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 04, 2005 02:43 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Steve, another thing that has just come to mind for clarification. As a RSO, I am not allowed to respond to a Victim/Survivor Corner thread in that forum, am I allowed to copy out the relevant issues I wish to discuss and create a seperate thread in the "general" forum and respond to them there ? In this way those that might have relevant information to be passed along to a Victim/Survivor would be able to do so , and it would be up to the Victim/Survivor to decide if they want to read such responses in the "General" forum. or possibly a person authorized to respond in the Victim/Survivor forum would be able to read the information and pass it along within the original thread.
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Message 166441 (In Reply to Message 166440)
Posted by Valerie
on Nov 04, 2005 02:51 PM | Also by Valerie
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: 30 - 39,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
How many days is this gonna go on..Steve was very specific in his description of who is to post where...if you want participation from certian people say so...or say "Valerie" dont respond....laughing....
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Message 166460 (In Reply to Message 166441)
Posted by dp1
on Nov 04, 2005 03:57 PM | Also by dp1
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
How many days is this gonna go on..Steve was very specific in his description of who is to post where..
It wasn't clear to me Valerie. My assumption was that I was in the category of RSO supporter and found out otherwise after the fact. I suppose now I can be considered a former RSO supporter who can't support RSOs. Considering most of the RSO issues have to do with probation and legal issues, which had nothing to do with the friction causing the change in the victim's forum, I'm at loss as to how the LE/PO ban will foster an environment of support and meaningful discussion. It never once ocurred to me that I was expected not to post to the other side. The need is obviously there so why would I assume LE was banned? The same confussion will cause conflicts in the victim's forum as well IMHO. We are not all black or white. As far as LE posting I assumed we were all in favor of abiding by the law and enforcing the rules.
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Message 166465 (In Reply to Message 166460)
Posted by Valerie
on Nov 04, 2005 04:29 PM | Also by Valerie
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
It was a joke Dp1 ...at my expense....the general consensus is You may post anywhere you want...no so much the rest of us and especially me...
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Message 166466 (In Reply to Message 166439)
Posted by dp1
on Nov 04, 2005 04:30 PM | Also by dp1
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
I agree Rabbit. However, I believe it's in everyone's best interests to think outside of the box. I'm sure Steve struggles with this daily. What if there was a PO or LEO that had more experience than Eagle and I put together that was lurking but was afraid to post because he didn't get a personal invitation? Same goes for therapist. Same goes for lawyer, etc etc. Wouldn't it be easier simply to say who shouldn't post whether it be a certain group of people or a spcific person. In all fairness, I've see very few people that the RSOs simply will not tolerate.
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Message 166468 (In Reply to Message 166465)
lol
Posted by anti
on Nov 04, 2005 04:43 PM | Also by anti
| Gender: N/A,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: N/A,
Country: United States |
also, I think steve posted also if anyone had a problem not knowing they could pm him prvt? or am I wrong?
I just dont see, as you, what is so hard here............
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Message 166476 (In Reply to Message 166460)
Off Duty PO posting?
Posted by Renunciation
on Nov 04, 2005 05:11 PM | Also by Renunciation
| Gender: N/A,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: N/A,
Country: Bahrain |
You can post in my Other Side threads anytime you want DP1, as long as you are off duty!! ;-)).
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Message 166498 (In Reply to Message 166465)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 04, 2005 10:03 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Val, I would have thought the same thing as you, that since dp1 has shown support for both sides of the issue, she would be allowed to post in both forums, but alas, her posts were moderated out of at least one thread in the other side, so I think steve is doing what he feels best by tightening the reins until a happy medium can be found. I was not trying to create any controversy, i was just trying to get a clearer picture of the new rules and find out what the limits are BEFORE steve has to reject one of my posts and I get reprimanded.
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Message 166507 (In Reply to Message 166476)
Posted by dp1
on Nov 05, 2005 02:24 AM | Also by dp1
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Thanks for your kind words Renny. Yes I'm off duty, but I can't seem to quit this role. Darnit. Actually, it seems I could do the most good posting with offenders about topics I'm very familiar with and feel comfortable talking about.
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Message 166627 (In Reply to Message 166441)
Posted by orolan
on Nov 05, 2005 10:51 PM | Also by orolan
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: N/A,
Country: United States |
Steve was very specific in his description of who is to post where
Obviously not specific enough.
ROTFLMAO
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Message 166629 (In Reply to Message 166498)
Posted by orolan
on Nov 05, 2005 10:55 PM | Also by orolan
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: N/A,
Country: United States |
her posts were moderated out of at least one thread in the other side
In Steve's defense, the thread had an inappropriate post by a person not permitted to post in The Other Side. That post and the responses to it were rejected. It's always been that way when he rejects posts. Everything under it typically goes as well.
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Message 166819 (In Reply to Message 166629)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 07, 2005 08:03 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Again, there was no disrespect for steve in that statement, I was just answering something that Valerie had said.
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Message 166839 (In Reply to Message 166466)
Posted by steve
on Nov 08, 2005 12:29 AM | Also by steve
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Virginia,
Country: United States |
Wouldn't it be easier simply to say who shouldn't post whether it be a certain group of people or a spcific person.
That depends on what you mean by "easier" and for whom you mean it'll be "easier". Most users do not list their occupation, offender or advocate status, etc. or other relevant details in their user profile. Until they've shared enough details about themselves in their posts, how do we know whether they're someone who should be permitted? What ideas do you have? I want to avoid constantly deleting posts from someone that are several days or weeks old and fielding complaints from users that posts from inappropriate people are slipping through the cracks. Suggestions?
I am open to the "regulars" from a forum designating someone a guest with an open invitation, but I don't think that leaving it open to all and blacklisting types of people and individuals once discovered or decided will be effective.
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Message 166840 (In Reply to Message 166437)
Posted by steve
on Nov 08, 2005 12:35 AM | Also by steve
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Virginia,
Country: United States |
The only thing still not 100% clear to me is whether or not I, as a RSO, am allowed to create a thread in the Victims corner if that thread is SOLELY about dealing with a specific Victim/Survivor issue I might be having?
For now, no. Eventually, quite likely, but it probably won't be permitted until I implement a way to flag posts in the thread so a potential reader is aware the posts are written by a sex offender. I want the reader to be given fair warning so they can decide whether to read it or not. That's not possible now so you can't post there currently.
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Message 166841 (In Reply to Message 166440)
Posted by steve
on Nov 08, 2005 12:40 AM | Also by steve
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Virginia,
Country: United States |
Steve, another thing that has just come to mind for clarification. As a RSO, I am not allowed to respond to a Victim/Survivor Corner thread in that forum, am I allowed to copy out the relevant issues I wish to discuss and create a seperate thread in the "general" forum and respond to them there ? In this way those that might have relevant information to be passed along to a Victim/Survivor would be able to do so , and it would be up to the Victim/Survivor to decide if they want to read such responses in the "General" forum.
I'm not going to open that door right now. While we're on the topic, I may be prohibiting discussing a thread from either of the restricted forums in any other forum on this site without clearing it with me first.
or possibly a person authorized to respond in the Victim/Survivor forum would be able to read the information and pass it along within the original thread.
As an alternative, you can pass the information on to me and if I think it's worth passing on I can pass it on in the thread in question or privately.
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Message 166843 (In Reply to Message 166498)
Posted by steve
on Nov 08, 2005 12:49 AM | Also by steve
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Virginia,
Country: United States |
I made some new policies, which I am enforcing. I am being more strict with some than I have in the past and possibly more strict than I'd like to be long term. I was hoping that everyone would respect the rules and adhere to them and that after there was some semblance of order and most of the posts were constructive, I could loosen them somewhat. Frankly, many users have disappointed me and I'm extremely surprised that a handful have whined like babies and either stormed off or threatened to. For any that think I am talking about them, don't flatter yourself by thinking that you're the only one that behaved that way or that your behavior was the most extreme I dealt with. Also keep in mind that you aren't privy to the private messages and emails I received or the several dozen posts that were rejected before ever seeing the light of day in the forums.
Now, finally, to my point. dp1 was politely told that she was not to post to The Other Side, at least for the time being, reasons were shared, and she was encouraged to hold her horses. That's all I have to say about that because what she and I discussed is between her and I.
I have an idea I'd like to propose that will hopefully be well received and considered a fair solution. I'll share it in a new thread in this forum later this evening.
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Message 166876 (In Reply to Message 166843)
Posted by dp1
on Nov 08, 2005 04:09 AM | Also by dp1
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
I noticed you've been rejecting postes in the other side from non-RSOs. Is there some reason you haven't rejected Jakes? He is not a confirmed RSO and no one has been able to tell the truth about his alleged pedphilia. I don't understand why the RSOs should be subjected to non-RSO posts unless of course they welcome Jake as a visitor or have confirmed his pedophilia which I sincerely doubt is the case. I find it offensive that he is catagorized a pedo/RSO when in fact that isn't the case. The people in the other side have enough issues with labels and the last thing we need to do is add more. Just my 2 cents. Reject the posts and ban him from both forums as he fits no category. The general forum is VERY appropriate for this non-RSO/non-Victim.
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Message 166910 (In Reply to Message 166840)
Posted by rabbitreborn
on Nov 08, 2005 03:00 PM | Also by rabbitreborn
| Gender: Male,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
fair enough, and thank you for responding.
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Message 166914 (In Reply to Message 166843)
Steve
Posted by dp1
on Nov 08, 2005 03:49 PM | Also by dp1
| Gender: Female,
Age Bracket: N/A,
State: Florida,
Country: United States |
Frankly, many users have disappointed me and I'm extremely surprised that a handful have whined like babies and either stormed off or threatened to. For any that think I am talking about them, don't flatter yourself by thinking that you're the only one that behaved that way or that your behavior was the most extreme I dealt with. Also keep in mind that you aren't privy to the private messages and emails I received or the several dozen posts that were rejected before ever seeing the light of day in the forums.
Steve,
I'm sorry you feel that certain posters have disappointed you. I can't imagine the amount of "hate mail" you must receive on an hourly basis. There isn't one person on this forum that doesn't appreciate your efforts and respect the difficult position you are in. If we weren't so passionate about what we believed in we wouldn't get angry. I want to thank you for being patient and understanding. We're all on the same side as far as wanting to work with you to make this a better place.
Dp1
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Thread
166369, rabbitreborn, Nov 03, 2005 10:13 PM
166398, orolan, Nov 04, 2005 02:25 AM
166439, rabbitreborn, Nov 04, 2005 02:37 PM
166466, dp1, Nov 04, 2005 04:30 PM
166839, steve, Nov 08, 2005 12:29 AM
166406, steve, Nov 04, 2005 03:01 AM
166437, rabbitreborn, Nov 04, 2005 02:29 PM
166840, steve, Nov 08, 2005 12:35 AM
166910, rabbitreborn, Nov 08, 2005 03:00 PM
166440, rabbitreborn, Nov 04, 2005 02:43 PM
166441, Valerie, Nov 04, 2005 02:51 PM
166460, dp1, Nov 04, 2005 03:57 PM
166465, Valerie, Nov 04, 2005 04:29 PM
166468, anti, Nov 04, 2005 04:43 PM [lol]
166498, rabbitreborn, Nov 04, 2005 10:03 PM
166629, orolan, Nov 05, 2005 10:55 PM
166819, rabbitreborn, Nov 07, 2005 08:03 PM
166843, steve, Nov 08, 2005 12:49 AM
166876, dp1, Nov 08, 2005 04:09 AM
166914, dp1, Nov 08, 2005 03:49 PM [Steve]
166476, Renunciation, Nov 04, 2005 05:11 PM [Off Duty PO posting?]
166507, dp1, Nov 05, 2005 02:24 AM
166627, orolan, Nov 05, 2005 10:51 PM
166841, steve, Nov 08, 2005 12:40 AM
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