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Forum: Old Message Board
Thread (Discussion): Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Message 115288
Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Posted by x_Steve
on Sep 08, 2003 09:25 AM | Also by x_Steve
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Sometime during the last few weeks I mentioned that documented cases of vigilantes trying to injure or kill convicted sex offenders were few and far between. I said that because I don't recall seeing more than a few cases over the last 5 years.
It appears a New Hampshire man stabbed a sex offender who appeared on New Hampshire's state sex offender registry and had a list of other registered offenders in his apartment, some with check marks next to their names. According to the Concord Monitor he knew the sex offender from when they attended prison together.
He may also have been responsible for an arson at a home where three registered offenders lived. According to the Concord Monitor a second potentially related fire (no mention of sex offenders at the address).
The article mentions that the attacker in question is a parolee, paroled a year ago after serving 3 years for receiving stolen property. It does mention that he was tried and acquitted of the murder of an elderly woman in the 1980s though.
Obviously I don't advocate or condone using the sex offender registries for such purposes so I hope this person (if determined to be guilty) is convicted, kept in prison for a long time and gets treatment and counseling if he'll ever be released.
See:
http://www.thebostonchannel.com/news/2457066/detail.html
http://www.cmonitor.com/stories/news/local2003/090303sexoffender_2003.shtml
or
http://www.sexcriminals.com/news/15285/
http://www.sexcriminals.com/news/15286/
-Steve, SexCriminals.com
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Message 115290 (In Reply to Message 115288)
Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Posted by x_orolan
on Sep 08, 2003 10:03 AM | Also by x_orolan
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Steve,
I can bet there will be quite a debate in the jury room about the "end justifying the means". Hopefully common sense will prevail and they will come back with a conviction.
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Message 115313 (In Reply to Message 115290)
Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Posted by x_marta
on Sep 08, 2003 01:00 PM | Also by x_marta
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I think the only person who might make such an "ends justify the means argument" (and they would never say it outright, mind you) will be the defense, at which point the prosecution will obtain a sustained objection. Courtrooms aren't all circuses, you know, despite popular opinion of them.
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Message 115320 (In Reply to Message 115288)
Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Posted by x_VTOWNLEYLONDON
on Sep 08, 2003 02:41 PM | Also by x_VTOWNLEYLONDON
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The fact that there have been relativly few reports of vigilantism may be misleading.The American press generally supports "Megan's" law,and so doesn't with a few exceptions(just type 'Megan's law consensual underage' into a search engine to get them)expose it's abuses and persecution of consensual underage "Romeo and Juliet" offenders,drunken Mooners,children(Texas has posted a ten year old boy and an eleven year old girl,effectivly a form of officially produced child pornography shamefully broadcast to the World)and those convicted of victimless offences.
Presumably the press also does this re the cases of vigilantism "Megan's" law instigates,in tihis country the press has reported that there have been many acts of vigilantism in America facilitated by "Megan's" law.
America does not have a truly national press ,so it is often difficult to get valid overall information from it.
I
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Message 115327 (In Reply to Message 115288)
Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender
Posted by x_VTOWNLEYLONDON
on Sep 08, 2003 02:56 PM | Also by x_VTOWNLEYLONDON
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The fact that there have been relativly few reports of vigilantism may be misleading.The American press generally supports "Megan's" law,and so doesn't with a few exceptions(just type 'Megan's law consensual underage' into a search engine to get them)expose it's abuses and persecution of consensual underage "Romeo and Juliet" offenders,drunken Mooners,children(Texas has posted a ten year old boy and an eleven year old girl,effectivly a form of officially produced child pornography shamefully broadcast to the World)and those convicted of victimless offences.
Presumably the press also does this re the cases of vigilantism "Megan's" law instigates,in this country the press has reported that there have been many acts of vigilantism in America facilitated by "Megan's" law.
America does not have a truly national press ,so it is often difficult to get valid overall information from it.
In this country the News of the World's name and shame campaign produced a national wave of vigilantism,including the Paulsgrove Witchunt,where a previously normal peaceful English town became a vicious latterday Salem,with innocent people attacked families driuven to flight ,and children's lives endangered.Despite this American campaigners for "Megan's" law,including Mark Klaas and tragic Mrs Maureen Kanka flew here to support the News of the Worlds pogrom.
Two children have so far been killed(with others hurt and only narrowly saved from death),burned alive in their own homes in Britain in attacks on suspected sex offenders,2 others have in Northern Ireland,and one in Eire.
In America there are tens of thousands of children living at the adresses posted on the websites.Have any so far died (I think ss said some had?.)
If not how long till they do?
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Message 115328 (In Reply to Message 115313)
ends justifies means
Posted by x_simon
on Sep 08, 2003 03:26 PM | Also by x_simon
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The way I read orolan's comment is that the rationalization will be in the "jury room". I can imagine that a few or more moralist will rationalize a justification for the crime. Of course the defense is going try and introduce doubt into the minds (and emotions) of the jury members. I would if I were the defense counsel - I would just do so implicity, denying the prosecution an opportunity to object.
**
There was a recent case in Baltimore (or maybe D.C.) where a young man alledged that a priest had molested him some years ago. The young man who is in his 20's confronted the priest one night and proceeded to shoot him in front of witnesses. The priest eventually recovered. The young man was charged with attempted murder, but recieved only the minor penalty of house arrest for gun possession. I'll try to dig up a link or maybe Steve aready has the article in his archive.
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Message 115333 (In Reply to Message 115313)
here's the link
Posted by x_simon
on Sep 08, 2003 03:48 PM | Also by x_simon
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Here's the link that I referenced above:
http://www.sunspot.net/news/local/bal-te.md.stokes18dec18,0,2363979.story
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Deal gets Stokes home detention on gun charges in priest shooting
Jurors defend acquittal in attempted murder
Lawyers brokered a deal yesterday that ensures Dontee D. Stokes, the West Baltimore man who admits to shooting a Roman Catholic priest during an "out-of-body" experience, will not spend a day in prison and will be allowed to serve a modest sentence on home detention.
The deal, worked out in Baltimore Circuit Court and agreed to by a judge, comes a day after a city jury acquitted Stokes of attempted murder - a decision that several jurors defended yesterday as the right thing to do. Many said they believed Stokes' claim that he had been sexually abused nine years ago by the man he shot, the Rev. Maurice J. Blackwell.
"We all have experienced out-of-body times in our lives," said Carlton L. Simmons, a 61-year- old retiree and an alternate juror who participated in the deliberations. "We prayed to God to give us guidance."
Simmons and at least one other juror, a 41-year-old food service manager, said they found the out-of-body defense - Stokes testified that he saw a white light and felt "outside my body" as the gun went off - to be believable. Stokes' lawyer, Warren A. Brown, argued that his client wasn't criminally responsible for the shooting because he was having an out-of-body experience in the midst of a mental disorder.
While the jury's decision was assailed by a prosecutor who said he fears the verdict will usher in an "open season" of vigilantism on Baltimore streets, Brown applauded the jury and successfully argued yesterday that Stokes shouldn't go to prison. The jury on Monday acquitted Stokes of six felony counts, but convicted him of three minor handgun charges.
"He'll never see a day of jail," said Brown, who worked out the terms of yesterday's deal with Sylvester Cox, the prosecutor in the case.
Under the terms of the arrangement, which must be formally entered into the record at Stokes' sentencing Feb. 14, Stokes will serve a maximum of 11 months on home detention. He will also receive three years' probation, the lawyers and Judge John N. Prevas agreed.
The emotionally charged case, happening at a time when the Catholic church has been embroiled in a sex scandal, has drawn many supporters to Stokes' corner. Some have created a fund-raising Web site, www.DonteeStokesFund.net, which features several photos of Stokes when he was a young church-goer.
As jurors left the courtroom yesterday, several hugged Stokes' mother and aunts. Some spoke a phrase often repeated by Stokes' family during the trial: "God is good." The jury consisted of 11 women and one man.
Jurors said they thought prosecutors did a poor job preparing the case. Some also said they felt Stokes had endured enough pain because of the alleged sexual abuse, and because authorities doubted his claims during the initial investigation nine years ago.
"This man [Stokes] has been suffering since 1993," said Catherine Robinson, 39, who participated in the deliberations. "The state's attorney knew about it and did nothing since '93. Cardinal [William H.] Keeler knew and did nothing. And that's been detrimental for this man's life."
The state's attorney's office investigated Blackwell in 1993 but never charged him. The same year, the church briefly sent Blackwell away for an evaluation, then reinstated him.
Keeler testified during the trial that he regretted returning Blackwell to his parish, St. Edward Roman Catholic Church in West Baltimore. The cardinal, in two of the more dramatic moments of the weeklong trial, warmly shook Stokes' hand before and after his testimony.
Keeler's testimony and apology did little to sway the jury either way, Robinson said.
"A lot of us were unmoved by the cardinal," she said.
Robinson was the jury's secretary, keeping track of votes while the members deliberated for more than eight hours Monday.
She said that at first, one or two jurors wanted to convict Stokes on the attempted-murder charge, but they were eventually swayed to acquit. After that, the initial votes on the other eight counts were nearly unanimous.
Another juror, a 41-year-old woman who declined to give her name, said she felt Stokes had endured enough pain.
"I think he's a very nice man and he's been through enough," the woman said. "We believed it was an out-of-body experience, of course. I don't think his intention was to hurt [Blackwell] at all."
Stokes testified during the trial that he shot Blackwell, the priest who baptized him, three times in the hand and hip with a .357 Magnum handgun. He said Blackwell repeatedly molested him when he was a teen-ager and that, at the time of the shooting, he was confronting the priest on a West Baltimore street to find "reconciliation."
He said in a police report that he became angry when the priest pretended to ignore him that day.
Blackwell couldn't be reached for comment yesterday. He refused to answer questions when called to the witness stand last week, invoking his Fifth Amendment right to remain silent on the grounds he might incriminate himself.
The defense brought in a psychiatrist, Michael K. Spodak, to testify that Stokes was suffering from "depersonalization" and "disassociation" at the time of the attack. Spodak said Stokes did not know what he was doing when he shot Blackwell.
A state doctor also examined Stokes, but found that he was criminally responsible for the crime. The prosecution did not submit that report to the jury. The defense did not submit its doctor's mental examination for the jury's review.
The three minor handgun charges Stokes was convicted of could have carried a total maximum penalty of seven years in prison. With the verdict, jurors sent a handwritten note to the judge, asking him to be lenient in his sentencing.
Brown, Stokes' lawyer, said before the trial that he wanted an all-female jury because he believed women would be more sympathetic to Stokes.
Jurors said that while the mostly female composition of the jury may have favored Stokes, they did not base their decision on pity.
"We strictly relied on the facts," Robinson said.
The prosecution and the defense agreed yesterday to not proceed with the second phase of the trial, which would have determined whether Stokes was criminally responsible for the handgun charges he was convicted of Monday.
They also agreed on a "miscellaneous agreement" that set the 18-month sentencing guidelines for Stokes.
Cox, the prosecutor, asked the judge to send Stokes to prison for 18 months. Brown asked if Stokes could serve the sentence at home while he appeals the verdict, to which the judge agreed. Stokes was also given credit for seven months he has served under house arrest awaiting trial.
Brown is appealing the verdict because, he said, the manner in which the jury deliberated was improper. The 12 members of the jury deliberated along with four alternates, something that is almost unheard of in a criminal case.
The four alternates deliberated only for the first few hours with the core 12 members. After that, Prevas instructed them to remain silent and only observe.
The reason behind it, Prevas said, is that he wanted to retain the four alternates in case they were needed if the trial continued on to its second phase to determine Stokes' criminal responsibility.
Brown said that was "illegal."
"Some people might say, 'You got good results,'" Brown said. "If the extra jurors hadn't been in there, I might not have gotten any guilty counts."
Brown also dismissed accusations that the verdict would encourage people to settle disputes with handguns.
"This verdict doesn't make a broad statement about vigilante justice or taking the law into your own hands," Brown said. "It deals with a guy who briefly lost his mind."
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Message 115349 (In Reply to Message 115333)
Re: here's the link
Posted by x_orolan
on Sep 08, 2003 04:38 PM | Also by x_orolan
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Good show, Simon. You read it right.
I also am reminded of something I read where a man was convicted of molesting his stepdaughter without a shred of physical evidence. The jury foreman was quoted as saying "We had our doubts about the crime but felt that even if he hadn't actually done it, he was probably THINKING about doing it. So we voted to convict." I think it was in Virginia, but can't find it again.
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Message 115545 (In Reply to Message 115288)
This is why registries are bad
Posted by x_Navigatr1
on Sep 10, 2003 02:29 AM | Also by x_Navigatr1
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There has been vigilantism towards sex offenders. Some of it is subtle, while others are visible such as this. The press does report some of the more egarious forms of vigilantism. I think that this guy should be required to register as a sex offender if he ever gets out.
We are going to see more cases of vigilantism as more and more sex offenders get added to the registry. People are going to be so angry that sex offenders are living near them, that they are going to take the law into their own hands.
--Navigatr1
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Message 141319 (In Reply to Message 115545)
Man gets prison for sex offender murder attempts
Posted by Navigatr1
on Nov 19, 2004 06:48 AM | Also by Navigatr1
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Man gets prison for sex offender murder attempts
Lawrence Trant will serve up to 30 years on plea deal
http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20041117/REPOSITORY/411
170317/1031
By ANNMARIE TIMMINS
Monitor staff
November 17. 2004 8:00AM
Four months after a jury was unable to convict Lawrence Trant of attempted murder for allegedly trying to kill a registered sex offender, he has pleaded guilty to trying to kill two other sex offenders.
Trant, 57, was sentenced to 10 to 30 years in prison as part of a plea deal he reached with prosecutors last month. As part of that agreement, prosecutors dropped six other attempted murder charges and an arson charge.
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Message 148449 (In Reply to Message 115327)
something to renew
Posted by poetsdreamscape
on Mar 30, 2005 06:20 AM | Also by poetsdreamscape
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Do any of you know what the actaul yearly statistics are for attacks on offenders
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Message 148646 (In Reply to Message 148449)
Posted by Navigatr1
on Mar 31, 2005 10:20 PM | Also by Navigatr1
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poetsdreamscape wrote:
Do any of you know what the actaul yearly statistics are for attacks on offenders
I don't believe there are any published statistics on attacks on sex offenders. Most attacks probably go unreported anyway. The closest thing to statistics would be information available at the "Legal Issues & Court Cases Affecting Sex Offenders" website.
http://www.geocities.com/eadvocate/issues/index.html
--Navigatr1
CopWatch.com News Moderator
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Message 148660 (In Reply to Message 141319)
Posted by orolan
on Apr 01, 2005 02:45 AM | Also by orolan
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In other words, he's on the street after serving 1/4 of the minimum 10. A parolee who was going to kill 9 people. And nobody will have a clue where he is, planning the next crimes.
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Thread
115288, x_Steve, Sep 08, 2003 09:25 AM [Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender]
115290, x_orolan, Sep 08, 2003 10:03 AM [Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender]
115313, x_marta, Sep 08, 2003 01:00 PM [Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex offender]
115328, x_simon, Sep 08, 2003 03:26 PM [ends justifies means]
115333, x_simon, Sep 08, 2003 03:48 PM [here's the link]
115349, x_orolan, Sep 08, 2003 04:38 PM [Re: here's the link]
115320, x_VTOWNLEYLONDON, Sep 08, 2003 02:41 PM [Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex o...]
115321, Rejected
115322, Rejected
115323, Rejected
115324, Rejected
115325, Rejected
115326, Rejected
115327, x_VTOWNLEYLONDON, Sep 08, 2003 02:56 PM [Re: Man allegedly tried to kill sex o...]
148449, poetsdreamscape, Mar 30, 2005 06:20 AM [something to renew]
148646, Navigatr1, Mar 31, 2005 10:20 PM
115545, x_Navigatr1, Sep 10, 2003 02:29 AM [This is why registries are bad]
141319, Navigatr1, Nov 19, 2004 06:48 AM [Man gets prison for sex offender murder a...]
148660, orolan, Apr 01, 2005 02:45 AM
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