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Orolan: I agree in principle with your 2-step process. Where would that leave all the credentialed experts and "laymen" experts who think we need them in order to get through this life, then? I participated in AA for a length of time and learned some good stuff from them, but after awhile, I began to see it as hanging onto a negative for too long. I couldn't tell you how many stories I heard from people who had over 30 years of sobriety and how they were still struggling with desires to drink on a daily basis. In Chapter 6 of the AA Big Book, titled "Into Action," there's a paragraph that states: "And we have ceased fighting anything or anyone--even alcohol. For by this time sanity will have returned. We will seldom be interested in liquor. If tempted, we recoil from it as a flame. We react sanely and normally, and we will find that this has happened automatically. We will see that our new attitude toward liquor has been given us without any thought or effort on our part. It just comes! That is the miracle of it. We are nor fighting it, neither are we avoiding temptation. We feel as though we had been placed in a position of neutrality--safe and protected. We have not even sworn off. Instead, the problem has been removed. It does not exist for us. We are neither cocky nor are we afraid. That is our experience. That is how we react so long as we keep in fit spiritual condition." These quoted words from the Big Book are called by many as "The Promises." I would think that after 30-plus years of being in AA, following the steps, and working the principles into one's daily routine, that many of those still complaining about having drinking tendencies, etc. would be beyond that phase of their addiction and be into "The Promises" aspect of their AA walk. All that brings me to another question about AA in relationship to demands by State parole and probation requirements for many to have to participate in it as a condition for them. As the AA program is spiritual in its foundation and involves a "God as we understand Him," etc. etc., how can the State force someone who doesn't believe in spiritual aspects into participating in these programs? Obviously, AA, NA, and other 12-step programs aren't connected to a particular religious institution, but they do push the idea of laying down spiritual roots into one's life in order for the addiction to be handled. Your thoughts on this? Forum Home | Top of Thread | Jump To Parent (122192) In order to post a message to a new thread or reply to existing messages you must be logged in. If you'd like to post messages please login or register as a new user. Message 122245 (In Reply to Message 122197)Posted by orolan on Nov 24, 2003 09:20 PM | Also by orolan
I used to drink a lot, but only on weekends. Then I got to where I would get a beer after work most days, to drink on the way home. Then it got to where I HAD to have that beer EVERY day after work. I only drank that one, but man was I ill if I couldn't have one for whatever reason. It wasn't the quantity that was an issue. It was the routine, the NEED that was a problem. I decided that I didn't like the fact that a single beer could have such an effect on my life. So I decided that I was no longer going to drink that beer every day. And I stopped. I still drink socially, and like to have a few beers with my brothers from time to time. But I can take it or leave it. Two steps. Recognize a problem, and do something to change. It also worked for me when I decided many years ago that a cocaine high was nowhere near worth the money it cost, so I quit drugs completely. Never had a relapse in 25 years. Forum Home | Top of Thread | Jump To Parent (122197) In order to post a message to a new thread or reply to existing messages you must be logged in. If you'd like to post messages please login or register as a new user. Message 122520 (In Reply to Message 122245)Posted by PVulcan on Dec 01, 2003 02:23 AM | Also by PVulcan
I've never attended an AA or NA or any other A meeting before, but isn't it 'faith' based? My outlook is similar to oralons on this topic but having known many people that have gone through the step program including the 'family of' program, it seems faith based. Funny, many years ago I ended up in a chat room on aol, Friends of Bill I think it was. I went in there thinking it would be discussion about Clinton but noooooooo...it was AA. When I stated my opinion about self action, they went balistic on me! They seem to think that their way is the ONLY way, and don't give kudos if someone tackles the problem any other way. Forum Home | Top of Thread | Jump To Parent (122245) Thread122181, lj, Nov 22, 2003 11:47 PM [Interesting critique of 12-step recovery programs] 122192, orolan, Nov 23, 2003 03:14 AM 122197, lj, Nov 23, 2003 05:58 AM [Two-stepping it through life!] 122245, orolan, Nov 24, 2003 09:20 PM 122520, PVulcan, Dec 01, 2003 02:23 AM Forum Home | Top of Thread
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